Brooklyn 5th alarm Commercial Fire 3/11/26 Box 2671

Yes, the FDNY Satellite units "Stang Inteligiant" monitors are capable of 4,000 GPM, but all too often they are used as hose wagons and not near enough the fire building/s to use their monitors. The old Super Pumper Tender Cab had a "Stang Inteligiant" monitor mounted on it with a large water way and 4 intakes for 4 1/2" hose. I have to look it up, but I know the output was well above 4,000 GPM. The idea was to use such a powerful stream, like a fireboat monitor, to blow the building apart, expose the fire to a very large amount of water and thereby control the fire, from a safe distance. I remember being at Church fire in lower Manhattan, the Tender cab Monitor was used to blow the roof off the church to stop the spread of fire and to protect the exposures. The problem people 2 blocks North of the Church fire people were being pelted with bricks blown off the front of the church by the Tender's monitor. This would not have created a problem if the bricks etc. were landing in the river last night. If you can't or won't place a satellite where it can use it's monitor it equals a hose wagon. Captain Bob Rainey FDNY Engine 26 retired
 
Darrell said:
It is, hasn't caught a run since January though, quarted at E238 and transported by 260 with 238 as the backup.

Pretty sure the only unit that runs less is the LGA and JFK Hosewagons
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291 should be the back up. 238 was not trained on the super pumper they didn’t want anything to do with it.
 
This begs my questions of,"did we waste money on this?"

I think we got it on a grant though, right? Could that grant money have give to something else, more useful? Like working engines, more satellites, another fireboat,etc?

What about all the hours of training done in something that'll never be used?

Yeah, it's nice to have"Just in case,"but they've had a few opportunities to use it now and haven't.
 
As has been discussed on here numerous times, those expecting to see the super pumper going to all big fires will be disappointed. They should have named it the foam pumper. To the extent it is going to be used, that's where you're going to see it.
 
NYBravest82 said:
This begs my questions of,"did we waste money on this?"

I think we got it on a grant though, right? Could that grant money have give to something else, more useful? Like working engines, more satellites, another fireboat,etc?

What about all the hours of training done in something that'll never be used?

Yeah, it's nice to have"Just in case,"but they've had a few opportunities to use it now and haven't.
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There's always going to be a type of call the Super Pumper is best suited for, when you have Fireboats + 2 Sat's in Operation, doesn't really seem best suited.
 
HFN01 said:
As has been discussed on here numerous times, those expecting to see the super pumper going to all big fires will be disappointed. They should have named it the foam pumper. To the extent it is going to be used, that's where you're going to see it.
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I wasn't expecting it to be used, more hoping as it seems like another perfect example it could be used for
 
NikFDNY said:
I wasn't expecting it to be used, more hoping as it seems like another perfect example it could be used for
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Ok, got it. So, how would it have made an impact on this incident? I'm not sold on that either. In the past, I can see how a 10,000gpm super pumper in a department with 1,000gpm engines would make an impact. Now, with 2,000gpm engines, I don't see how a 5,000gpm engine makes a huge difference (not to mention the dramatic increase in fire boat capacity). In other words, at a big fire, what is the SP going to do that a couple of engines and a satellite couldn't?
 
HFN01 said:
Ok, got it. So, how would it have made an impact on this incident? I'm not sold on that either. In the past, I can see how a 10,000gpm super pumper in a department with 1,000gpm engines would make an impact. Now, with 2,000gpm engines, I don't see how a 5,000gpm engine makes a huge difference (not to mention the dramatic increase in fire boat capacity). In other words, at a big fire, what is the SP going to do that a couple of engines and a satellite couldn't?
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Keeping the Marine Companies available would be one, Marine 1 was covering the entire city for awhile until they relieved 6 and 9.

I'm also sure it would've been able to untie some of the Engines and Tower Ladders. Obviously you still need to support the logistics of the super pumper
 
Darrell said:
Has the idea ever been floated around within the past couple of years of making one of the summer boats into a year long Marine Company?
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Not sure how much justification there would be for that given that most of the (great) work they do is rescue operations in seasonal tourist areas. In any event if we're talking about big fires the small boats don't have big capacity, they're mainly useful for accessing remote areas with water
 
Darrell said:
Has the idea ever been floated around within the past couple of years of making one of the summer boats into a year long Marine Company?
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I think this a good idea for even one. Doesn't have to be in a,"touristy"are, just a busy one. With NYC ferry expanding operations, plus the ice problem we had this year, and boating becoming more accessible and popular, the harbor will only see an increase in people on the water. It'd be crazy not to expand the Marine Division.

As for the Super Pumper, it just feels like they're almost afraid to use it, either cause they might break it, it break something else with it.
 
NYBravest82 said:
I think this a good idea for even one. Doesn't have to be in a,"touristy"are, just a busy one. With NYC ferry expanding operations, plus the ice problem we had this year, and boating becoming more accessible and popular, the harbor will only see an increase in people on the water. It'd be crazy not to expand the Marine Division.

As for the Super Pumper, it just feels like they're almost afraid to use it, either cause they might break it, it break something else with it.
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I think their rationale is that, since it was put in service primarily for airport/foam relays, consider the situation where it would be operating at the 5th alarm, and a crash box is transmitted for LGA, and the plane has a bad landing with a fuel tank rupture. What do they do now, besides transmit the foam matrix? It sits there like your insurance policy in your drawer.
 
Question about when a truck is operating in as an acting company. If it is says ladder 172 act. 114. Does that mean that 114 goes back in service or do it mean that both ladder 172 and 114 will be still operating and on scene.
 
zharrison said:
Question about when a truck is operating in as an acting company. If it is says ladder 172 act. 114. Does that mean that 114 goes back in service or do it mean that both ladder 172 and 114 will be still operating and on scene.
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When an actor goes into the job, they don't relieve the company they were acting for, no. Both operating but either could be released
 
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NYBravest82 said:
I think this a good idea for even one. Doesn't have to be in a,"touristy"are, just a busy one. With NYC ferry expanding operations, plus the ice problem we had this year, and boating becoming more accessible and popular, the harbor will only see an increase in people on the water. It'd be crazy not to expand the Marine Division.

As for the Super Pumper, it just feels like they're almost afraid to use it, either cause they might break it, it break something else with it.
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This is true, however the NYPD has a rather large Harbor division as well as air/sea rescue in their aviation division, so the resources for water rescues do still exist even if many FDNY marine units are tied up with firefighting ops.

Not saying it would hurt to add another boat, but the resources are there, albeit from a different agency.
 
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