Fire Boxes - Numbering System, Placement & Design

[Roosevelt Island 360]

Like many neighborhoods Roosevelt Island has a number of Fire Alarm Boxes scattered about the island.  I have a number of questions:

(1) How are the box numbers assigned and is there any pattern or method to the numbers assigned?
(2) How is the placement of a box determined?  Is it based on community involvement or regulatory based?
(3) Are there any maps detailing the locations of all the boxes in a neighborhood?
(4) I have noted several box designs on the island.  Are boxes just left up until they are no longer operational or are any base requirements regarding their design when installed currently? And do the different designs each have names?

Sorry for all the questions. Thank you, Eric

http://RooseveltIsland360.blogspot.com

 

[catry]

To the best of my knowledge, actual fire alarm boxes are scattered around the city in a rough grid pattern of every other block.  This includes ERS and mechanical boxes, including those that have been removed.  The FD's current box numbering system is reflective of when a physical box could be found this way, although now that many mechanical boxes have been removed it's more of a virtual map of empty box shells and remaining ERS boxes.  In Manhattan and the Bronx, the box numbers increase from south to north, east to west, with the highest being in Inwood and Roosevelt Island.  The exemption to this are boxes inside certain institutions and those located on major roadways, which are assigned numbers in the 8xxx range.
If you check out www.fdnewyork.com I believe there's a google earth map of all of Brooklyn's box locations somewhere there.
As for designs, I know that most remaining ERS boxes feature the lift plate with contact to FD and PD design.  No idea about the physical appearance, but ERS boxes are maintained regularly by the FD Communications Bureau.  My guess is that different designs are simply reflective of different year constructions, since the general functionality remains the same.

 

[FD347]

In the beginning the city consisted only of Manhattan and Bronx. Box numbers start at The Battery and continue north to the Westchester line. This is why Bronx and Manhattan have the same borough prefix, 6-6, no 2 box numbers are the same. (The exceptions are 8000 series boxes which came into being in recent times).

As new neighborhoods opened up the numbering sequence simply continued which is why Roosevelt Island is in the 1900 range and Battery Park City is in the 2000 range.

This general trend is evident in Brooklyn also with Greenpoint having the lowest numbers and increasing as you go south to the "newer" neighborhoods.

I haven't figured out Queens as the airports have boxes under 1000 and the rest of the borough starts with Far Rockaway and continues north.

As for the posts, I think economics may have played a part in the design, at least in modern times.

 

[catry]

I think the airport boxes correspond with the gate numbers at the airports; e.g. Box 37 at LGA is for the rendezvous at the LGA Firehouse Gate 37.

 

[FD347]

LGA box 37 is the rendezvous point, Bldg 37 which is PAPD. The same for JFK bldg 269.

 

[Roosevelt Island 360]

Thanks. I went to www.fdnewyork.com and punched in the numbers seen in the above pics.  Interesting to see the numbers exist in multiple boroughs at once.  The address for Roosevelt Island was a bit off but fairly close.  Again thanks.

 

[e203BCVFD]

Eric,

Many municipal buildings (i.e. schools, government buildings) and bridges and highways have boxes assigned in addition to the usual "intersection" boxes, usually beginning with an 8. For example, City Hall is Manhattan Box 8020, FDNY Headquarters is Brooklyn box 8120, Ellis Island is Manhattan Box 8421 and Liberty Island is Manhattan Box 8420. Some locations have multiple boxes, such as the Williamsburg Bridge which has 13 Boxes, the St. George Ferry Terminal which has 12 boxes, and FDNY Academy has 4 boxes. However, not all boxes for municpal/govenrment buildings are in the 8000 series.... Queens box 71 is Rikers Island, and few other exceptions.

A couple of interesting boxes are used for special purposes. For example, in Staten Island where I work, boxes 100, 200, 300, 400 are used for relocations. In the Bronx, box 3000 is used for mutual aid to City of Yonkers FD along with Bronx Box 8999, Queens boxes 600 and 700 are used for mutual aid to Nassau County.  Box 7777 is used for administartive purposes (out of service for mechanic fixing rig, medical office, etc) Where I live in the Rockaways, Queens Box 8300 is used for any alarm in the Breezy Point Cooperative district.

As far as the nighborhood box layout, that is an interesting question that can be figured out depending on how well you know the city. There is a method to the madness, usually certain neighborhoods can be figured out by the first two numbers. In an example, Brooklyn boxes beginning with 11xx are Bay Ridge boxes, Queens boxes starting with 74xx and 75xx are Astoria / L.I. City boxes, etc.

 

[mac8146]

FYI the box 7777 is administrative use or OOS, 6666 is for Company Meds and 8888 is for training at rock or other training assiignments.

 

[catry]

Every box number with the same 4 digits from 3333 up is reserved:
3333 - Unit out of service
4444 - Unit OOS for decon
5555 - Never used for obvious reasons
6666 - Report to 9 Metrotech for medical
7777 - Administrative Box
8888 - Report to the Rock for training
9999/9998 - Used when more than 1 box is transmitted for the same location.

The lowest box number is 10, which is for Whitehall St just south of Water St.

 

[e203BCVFD]

Every box number with the same 4 digits from 3333 up is reserved:
3333 - Unit out of service
4444 - Unit OOS for decon
5555 - Never used for obvious reasons
6666 - Report to 9 Metrotech for medical
7777 - Administrative Box
8888 - Report to the Rock for training
9999/9998 - Used when more than 1 box is transmitted for the same location.

The lowest box number is 10, which is for Whitehall St just south of Water St.

Hmmmm... I knew I forgot something  ;D

 

[Roosevelt Island 360]

Over the last few months I have begun to photograph all of the boxes on Roosevelt Island that I come across and I have noticed here and there the "stumps" from what were apparently Red Fire Boxes and not the standard Grey metal boxes that are most prevalent on the island.

I don't recall if I ever saw the stump pictured with a box on top but there are two such stumps within 75 yard sof each other and they each are across the street from 6 new residential buildings either already completed (405 Main thru 475 Main).  What is strange to me is that there is ONE working box behind these buildings on the next "street" but none visible on their street.  I am assuming that each lobby has a Fire Box control station.  Does that "fact" remove the need for on-street boxes?

Also when a box is removed is it standard to leave a stump?  It just seemed odd to see the stumps standing there.

Thanks, Eric

http://RooseveltIsland360.blogspot.com

http://rooseveltisland360.blogspot.com/2008/06/fire-police-call-boxes-existing-and.html

Stump

Full Red Box

Modern Grey Fire Box

 

 

[tbendick]

When the removed some of the boxes that did leave the stumps and some other parts.  Don't know the reasons for it, as far as the buildings having alarm systems, it doesn't have anything to do with the FDNY alarm boxes.

Here is a question for you.. Anyone notice the new FDNY fire Alarm box locater lights? 

 

[FD347]

The reason for leaving the post is that there is circuit wiring running through it. The circuits are still active even if the box is removed.

 

[vbcapt]

Tommy:

What are the box locator lights? Something on the box itself?

 

[bklyndisp54]

Here is a question for you.. Anyone notice the new FDNY fire Alarm box locater lights? 

Do you mean all those red (formerly orange) lights up on lamp-posts over intersections where the boxes are gone and only the posts remain?  ;D

 

[catry]

Here is a question for you.. Anyone notice the new FDNY fire Alarm box locater lights? 

Do you mean all those red (formerly orange) lights up on lamp-posts over intersections where the boxes are gone and only the posts remain?   ;D

I thought you meant all those lights above the working boxes that are never on

 

[Roosevelt Island 360]

The reason for leaving the post is that there is circuit wiring running through it. The circuits are still active even if the box is removed.

But if the box is gone why leave the circuit active?

I understand that these boxes were created / added at a time when cell phones were not prevalent or even existing but are new boxes generally added today? 

I was told by the Roosevelt Island Public Safety Director that as boxes fail on Roosevelt Island they are simply removed (presumably by the City and without replacement).

 

[FD347]

There's more than 1 box on a circuit and more than 1 circuit that runs through the posts. That's all I will say on that.

The alarm box system was very well thought out engineeringwise. I doubt anyone today would have the cranial fortitude to create one that's better. But despite it's original design, all it takes is one smallminded politician to undermine it.

 

[bklyndisp54]

But despite it's original design, all it takes is one smallminded politician to undermine it.

Yup.  Prob'ly the same sort of genius that wants to lump all the C.O.'s into 1 or 2 buildings.  (Makes it less work for the terrorists, yuh see.)

 

[Atlas]

Remember that the ISLAND is the former home of FDNY's Div. of Training. The 'Rock' box was 920 years ago.
The Island has also been a political football bouncing between Manhattan & Queens. So if I remember correctly, the box might have been changed to 1920 when Queens had control of the Island.

The current boxes were laid out there many years ago, long before the housing complexes were built. Street names were changed over the years & some boxes were moved. Others were added do to the new expanding residential community. The fire box post gives you an idea how long that box might have been at that location.

Yes, there is madness to the fire alarm box numbering system except for Queens. These numbers appear in many different communties.