SUPER PUMPER 1

Joined
Dec 28, 2009
Messages
521
i only skipped through a lot of the video, and i don't know as much as i used to, and i realize its only training, but if it takes even half as long and looks like its half as complex to setup, and requires that many people, it might as well just be worth it to wait for a rain shower to put the fire out.
 
Joined
Dec 7, 2018
Messages
3,288
i only skipped through a lot of the video, and i don't know as much as i used to, and i realize its only training, but if it takes even half as long and looks like its half as complex to setup, and requires that many people, it might as well just be worth it to wait for a rain shower to put the fire out.
It’s used for prolonged incident. It all depends how how far the water sources will be. Atleast 30-45mins to get into operation.
 
Joined
Nov 1, 2019
Messages
452
To get its full pressure it needs multiple sources…
Same with the old SP. it would hook up to two water sources sometimes blocks away from the fire. If there was a job down by the water, it used to be fed by a marine company then relay essentially to manifolds, TL, tender and satellites. In some cases it would also augment water to engines already hooked up at a scene
 
Joined
Jan 29, 2019
Messages
86
It’s used for prolonged incident. It all depends how how far the water sources will be. Atleast 30-45mins to get into operation.
While I'm not too knowledgeable about it, I'd assume that's still significantly less than the Neptune system that NJ has. I feel like this would be a lot easier to maneuver and setup than that entire system, which would lead to getting it into service a whole lot faster.


In other semi related news, I was an article yesterday where San Francisco has taken delivery of the first 3 of their hose tenders based off the same design we discussed somewhere in this thread.
 
Joined
Jul 20, 2022
Messages
346
While I do think that the they need exists for high-capacity pumpers, I'm not sure that the need exists for one for each satellite company. Especially considering all the new engine companies are 2000 GPM. The original super pumper wasn't used that often and back then the regular engine companies had less pump capacity.

As far as the tall tower letters go I think the problem being not being able to get them where they are needed. Unless they responded at the 1st you truck there probably would not be room in front of the structure for them to set up.
To get its full pressure it needs multiple sources…
I know what you're saying about the spread of the tormentors on very tall tower ladders. London Fire Brigade has 2 very tall tower ladders that they bought after the disaster at that high rise dwelling fire, in the Grenfield Towers. NYC streets are tight but not a tight as London, England. I feel the need is there and it is only a matter of time, before FDNY will need very tall tower ladders for a major High-rise fire, especially if the building burns when it is under construction. On the Super Pumper idea, I had a fire in Bushwick Brooklyn in 1977 that at one point involved 32 Buildings and the 1977 Great Black Out that had 1,300 working fires happen in just over 24 hours. The same conditions exist today as in 1977 and the chance of conflagrations exists especially in times of civil unrest. You need to have more of that very high-capacity pumping capability, available for those few fires that become uncontrollable. Captain Bob Rainey FDNY Engine 26 retiredFDNY 1977 Black Out View from thde air.jpg
 
Joined
Dec 7, 2018
Messages
3,288
i only skipped through a lot of the video, and i don't know as much as i used to, and i realize its only training, but if it takes even half as long and looks like its half as complex to setup, and requires that many people, it might as well just be worth it to wait for a rain shower to put the fire out.
It’s used for prolonged incident. It all depends how how far the water sources will be. Atleast 30-45mins to get into operation.
I know what you're saying about the spread of the tormentors on very tall tower ladders. London Fire Brigade has 2 very tall tower ladders that they bought after the disaster at that high rise dwelling fire, in the Grenfield Towers. NYC streets are tight but not a tight as London, England. I feel the need is there and it is only a matter of time, before FDNY will need very tall tower ladders for a major High-rise fire, especially if the building burns when it is under construction. On the Super Pumper idea, I had a fire in Bushwick Brooklyn in 1977 that at one point involved 32 Buildings and the 1977 Great Black Out that had 1,300 working fires happen in just over 24 hours. The same conditions exist today as in 1977 and the chance of conflagrations exists especially in times of civil unrest. You need to have more of that very high-capacity pumping capability, available for those few fires that become uncontrollable. Captain Bob Rainey FDNY Engine 26 retiredView attachment 35555
they tested a Bronco Skylift a few years ago, on the St. Patrick’s Cathedral. That was the main look at the Skylift due to the height of some of the churches but the shops said it was too much money to maintain and didn’t have a place to put it. L20 firehouse has the garage under firehouse so they couldn’t put it there. Wasn’t any other options at that time. Still a few firehouses that have issues with rigs now like Pitt Street.
 
Joined
Mar 7, 2023
Messages
301
Just because the pump is whatever gpm it matters on how much water you are getting remember the Marine Unit, Hydro Pumps are giving 2-3k each and then plus the hydrant. A 2,000 FDNY engine can do more on a good hydrant…
then why did the fdny in 2008 switch to 2000 gpm pump if a 1000 gpm pump can pump out more then that
 
Joined
Jan 29, 2019
Messages
86
Pressure and Volume are two different things when it comes to fire pumps. I've experienced plenty of hydrants that have a ton of flow but zero pressure, necessitating a pumper to be put on the hydrant to then push the volume in an increased pressured to the fireground. Where I work now, I can supply a TL off a hydrant without bumping the pressure up at all, some places we actually need to gate it down.

As for the FDNY move from 1000 to 2000gpm? I'm not on the job there, so I can't explain why, but I do know that the actual pump housing between most pumps is exactly the same, it's just the addition of extra plumbing and outlets that gets you you're increased GPM rating. My FD has a quint with a 2000GPM pump, that we had tested and certified to only 1500GPM so that when it's older and worn it will still be able to obtain that 1500gpm during annual testing. I have 15 years left until I'm eligible to retire and I doubt I'll see a replacement for that truck before I walk out the door.
 
Joined
Jul 27, 2021
Messages
134
So what is the FDNY still have high pressure pumpers ?
Are the 2000 GPM fire engines only rated at two stages ?
And then I believe from what I know is that the high-pressure buffers are three stages ?
Can someone verified and explain the difference please thank you
 
Joined
Nov 1, 2019
Messages
452
So what is the FDNY still have high pressure pumpers ?
Are the 2000 GPM fire engines only rated at two stages ?
And then I believe from what I know is that the high-pressure buffers are three stages ?
Can someone verified and explain the difference please thank you
I have heard some of the engines in the high rise districts have more than two stage pumpers. I cannot confirm
 
Joined
Mar 7, 2023
Messages
301
every engine past 2008 has a 2 stage 2000 gpm pump which can put out 600 PSI but most engines which aren't equipped with high pressure equipment aren't allowed to pump more then 300 psi , however a chief (battalion chief or above) can order to pump higher then 300 if that company isn't a high pressure company but its not recommended. The 2nd type is high pressure engines which are regular 2 stage engines which have special 3 inch high pressure hose with special high pressure outlets which if a chiefs orders it can pump up to 600 psi . some engines have a 3rd stage and have the letter H at the end of its designation EX. SP14002H .( 2014 Seagrave pumper high pressure ) and can pump by a chiefs orders in 3rd stage 700 PSI . the 3rd stage is better economically and can put out more volume of water at 500 psi due to the impeller needing less RPM to reach the desired PSI and the impeller spins slower allowing more water to enter the impeller .
 
Joined
Apr 1, 2007
Messages
4,041
I have heard some of the engines in the high rise districts have more than two stage pumpers. I cannot confirm
FDNY has eight 3-stage pumpers, assigned to Engine companies 6, 8, 10,26, 34,54, 65 and 258. You could have found this out by reading our FAQs . . . which contain a vast amount of information.

 
Joined
Oct 18, 2022
Messages
266
It’s used for prolonged incident. It all depends how how far the water sources will be. Atleast 30-45mins to get into operation.
Is that 45 minutes from arrival to first water or 45 minutes from arrival to pumping at a potential max capacity? Is that due to the pump needing to be primed up or does it take that long to stretch lines and get the system tied into its sources?
 

RCL

Joined
Jul 11, 2022
Messages
338
It’s used for prolonged incident. It all depends how how far the water sources will be. Atleast 30-45mins to get into operation.

they tested a Bronco Skylift a few years ago, on the St. Patrick’s Cathedral. That was the main look at the Skylift due to the height of some of the churches but the shops said it was too much money to maintain and didn’t have a place to put it. L20 firehouse has the garage under firehouse so they couldn’t put it there. Wasn’t any other options at that time. Still a few firehouses that have issues with rigs now like Pitt Street.

Another problem with the Brontos is that the support and parts are made overseas, and the company isn't that timely on parts, trouble shooting and repairs. Add in any additional fees for parts being imported and things get expensive fast. One of the other issues, is the horizontal reach of the units. None of the Brontos have over a 82 or 85 foot horizontal reach. I firget which off hand. Compared to the 92 foot horizontal reach of a 100' rearmount or a 89 foot reach of the 95' platforms.

Orange County FL has 2 brontos, both 114s, 1 is at truck 54 which protects Sea World and the I Drive area, and they spend more time in a spare then they do in there regular truck. The other one from talking to local crews isnt far behind. Theres a picture online somewhere that show the crew bailing out of the bucket of the same truck when a sensor failed, allowing the boom to sag into alligator waters at Gatorland, which was right after the rig was delivered.
 
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